The Hardball Times:Crossing the Bridge: A closer look at what happened to Barry Zito
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The Hardball Times found this 5/13/2008 on www.hardballtimes.com [flag] |
Tags:
MLB
Barry Zito
Comments (6)
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PaulNyman "It seems like motion capture technology could be used to make it easier to pick out these small changes in a pitchers throwing action."
Teams do send players to the ASMI (American Sports Medicine Institute Founded by Dr. James Andrews) for motion capture analysis.
"Then atleast half of the problem would be solved. The same system could be used in a trial and error approach to attempt to get the pitcher back to throwing the way they used to."
The problem is a classic one as in and garbage out as in who is going to analyze and interpret the data?
"Maybe some day a unniversity could get there hands on all of the data necessary to construct a computer model that outputs the throwing mechanics to the fastest fastball with the most movement."
The physics of drawing the baseball is straightforward. The problem this do you simulate the body throwing baseball this just too many variables to account for.
In reality you don't need to construct a computer model all you have to do is look at the mechanics of some of the finest where through a baseball such as Nolan Ryan.
"The problem would then boil down to teaching someone how to throw it without their arm falling off."
And there in lies the greatest problem of all who has all of the skills and capabilities necessary to:
1. Collect and analyze the data.
2. Formulate a plan of action
3. Convert shouldn't a specific goals and objectives.
4. Monitor the process and corrective actions (back to number 1 again).
Professional baseball simply is not equipped to do this. Baseball "culture" won't let it happen.
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notsellingjeans Very interesting, Paul. Thanks for your hard work.
I have a question regarding the image of Zito's hypothetical 92 mph skeleton:
His stride length looks remarkably short (that could be an optical illusion since I can only see it in 2D of course). I realize that part of your message is advocating a shorter stride rather than the long one which is typically preached.
But can you specify a little more for us? Should a pitcher stride their body length (a six-footer strides 6'), or much less than that? 92 mph Zito skeleton appears to be striding an incredibly short distance - say, 4 feet from the rubber? Please clarify if you can - I find this to be an interesting piece of information.
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PaulNyman "His stride length looks remarkably short (that could be an optical illusion since I can only see it in 2D of course)."
There is no difference in stride length between 83 mph Zito and 92 mph Zito 3D simulations.
"I realize that part of your message is advocating a shorter stride rather than the long one which is typically preached."
I was/am not advocating any change in stride length. I don't think I said this in the article if I did I apologize for misleading.
But can you specify a little more for us? Should a pitcher stride their body length (a six-footer strides 6'), or much less than that?The length of stride is what gets the job done. I was watching the Red Sox Twins game last night and the pitcher for Minnesota was consistently throwing 93-95 MPH with what appeared to be a short stride. What he was doing it is rotating his upper torso explosively to throw the baseball.
Stride length gets far too much blame-credit. Increasing stride length is one of the quickest ways to kill velocity because it often compromises rotation. It is my belief that increased dragline if it does increase velocity is simply because the pitcher becomes more aggressive in how he uses his body to throw the baseball, i.e. as greater in to throw.
"92 mph Zito skeleton appears to be striding an incredibly short distance - say, 4 feet from the rubber? Please clarify if you can - I find this to be an interesting piece of information."
92 mph Zito's stride length is the same as Zito's stride length. I have absolutely no idea how you can estimate that the stride length is 4 feet from the view that is shown??
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notsellingjeans Paul, you wrote:
It is possible that Zito, like most pitchers, coaches and instructors, believes that the further he releases the ball out in front , the greater his advantage. Nothing could be further from the truth.
Attempting to release the ball out iront (I think you mean "out in front") or extend to the batter is the quickest way to degrade velocity and movement. It becomes a vicious cycle, because as he tries to release further out in front and get more on the ball, he becomes more linear, which promotes more muscling of the ball and loss of mechanical advantage.--That's where I inferred that you were advocating a shorter stride length for Zito, to aid him in rotation. Aren't these two things: "releasing the ball further out in front" (your words) and "stride length" linked?
And again, please specify what you think an ideal stride length would be. Thanks for your replies.
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PaulNyman "--That's where I inferred that you were advocating a shorter stride length for Zito, to aid him in rotation. Aren't these two things: "releasing the ball further out in front" (your words) and "stride length" linked?"
Not usually. Releasing the ball in front is a whole body action, i.e. has to do more with sequencing of the delivery ( rhythm).
"And again, please specify what you think an ideal stride length would be."
Whatever gets the job done.
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It seems like motion capture technology could be used to make it easier to pick out these small changes in a pitchers throwing action. Then atleast half of the problem would be solved. The same system could be used in a trial and error approach to attempt to get the pitcher back to throwing the way they used to.
Maybe some day a unniversity could get there hands on all of the data necessary to construct a computer model that outputs the throwing mechanics to the fastest fastball with the most movement. The problem would then boil down to teaching someone how to throw it without their arm falling off.